Any 2-stroke gurus in here? Detroit 8v71 with misfire need help

Discussion in 'Heavy Duty Diesel Truck Mechanics Forum' started by Green461, Nov 10, 2022.

  1. Green461

    Green461 Light Load Member

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    Trying to figure out what this misfire is..
    Finding info on this is pretty tough... not one shop in a huge city has a clue when asked. "whoa...thats an antique."

    Engine: 8v71 Naturally aspirated. In 1981 Silver Eagle bus. Well kept, very clean no leaks, was stored for awhile (could be years).

    Symptom: It has dual exhaust and out the drivers side bank it sounds like a misfire, no smoke at all, just a pffft.....pffft....pffff.... Which sounds like 1 cylinder not getting fuel.

    Tests: Thermal temp gun initially done found forward most cylinder was 61 degrees while the others read about 95 at startup and idle... hard to get a good reading seeing the back cylinders merge into the front... but ran with that....

    Removed that first injector (forward one on back of engine, opposite side that governor sits) inspected.. bench tested. Metering rod loose and free. Fuel dispenses good when in vice and hit spring with rubber hammer.

    Removed the other injectors on that side... all good... or appear to be by my "test".

    Found control rack bracket bent and control rack about 1/4 inch off on one end.. not sure if was out of adjustment as i loosened before checking...

    Put all back together.. Fixed bend bracket, control tube now straight.. blew through all fuel tubes, clear and free, adjusted injector height to 1.484" adjusted rack by feel with throttle open all 4 as close as I could. I also purposely put injectors in opposite holes to see of problem would follow injector or cylinder.

    Test fire.. Exact same thing. Forward cylinder is the coldest and heading back they gradually get warmer with the front being the hottest... same flapping miss sound out of that side, no smoke, I high idled for a bit to heat it up... forward cylinder 1 - 140 degrees, 2- 150 degrees, 3- 175 degrees, 4- 190 degrees at the top of the exh manifold by the head....

    Youtube video of the bus and the exhaust sound.
    https://youtu.be/3-aflLjHX2U
     
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  3. bad-luck

    bad-luck Road Train Member

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    Try these guys Screenshot_20221110-112329_Chrome.jpg
     
  4. bad-luck

    bad-luck Road Train Member

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    Or this guy on YouTube Screenshot_20221110-112902_YouTube.jpg
     
    beastr123 Thanks this.
  5. lilillill

    lilillill Sarcasm... it's not just for breakfast

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    Remove the injector on that cylinder, put the piston up at TDC, then use a rubber tip blow gun to see if that hole is holding pressure.

    If that cylinder is getting fuel, the only other thing it can be is low compression. (Bent/burnt valve, etc.)
     
  6. OLDSKOOLERnWV

    OLDSKOOLERnWV Captain Redbeard

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    If it’s been setting a long while, check that the valves are seating properly.

    If it’s not combusting the fuel, the exhaust on that cylinder will be wet. From what I’m reading that you’ve done, it may be a valve burnt or bent, or possibly a piece of carbon on the seat.

    Did you check the valve lash on the rockers?

    If you inject air in to the cylinder through the injector hole, you can expect the piston to go down as it turns the engine.

    We start a lot of these big cube vintage oilfield engines by injecting air to get it rotating…,
     
    Green461 and cke Thank this.
  7. Green461

    Green461 Light Load Member

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    If that cylinder was getting fuel and not burning it wouldnt there be puffs of blue smoke out the exhaust? The video started out right at start up, once warm its clean and no smoke. No fuel smell. Its like the bank in general gets colder as you move backwards... Like lacking fuel. But the other bank is fine and it runs down the highway ok.
     
  8. Green461

    Green461 Light Load Member

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    Southern WI
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    Yes everything seems to be in spec... lash is good. I find it odd no smoke from unburned fuel.... Is there any special bleed procedure for these? How does fuel enter? From one end of head and then at the other end i see a cross over tube to the other head... is it a flow through each injector and out or is it a common rail feeding each injector? To me it sounds like no fuel, but the other bank runs fine and each injector test ok its that back corner that seems to not get fuel even though i adjusted the rack twice, fires up fine, still has that miss sound. If it had no compression in one hole where would the fuel go? I get nothing out the breather and oil is fine and no smoke out exhaust.
     
  9. Green461

    Green461 Light Load Member

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    Mar 22, 2019
    Southern WI
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    I went over and looked at it again today (its my dads). Rechecked valve lash, all good. started up almost instantly.
    I got thinking..
    1. Engine is pretty smooth
    2. Doesnt smoke at all.
    3. No fuel in oil, no blow by out breather
    4. All adjusted right.
    5. He said it went down the highway and got up to 75 just fine.
    6.. We were kinda talking about a loose baffle in muffler yesterday.. looked in and seems fine. Today I noticed one muffler is a 10" diameter one and the other on the popping side is a 7" diameter.. I put an elbow on the 10" side and its aimed it away its like super quite just a hum and rush of air sounding. On the 7" side you can hear the percussion of the firing and its way louder..... since I readjusted the rack and fixed bent bracket its not much of a pffft...pffft sound of air anymore, it actually sounds like its firing, like a harley. Same tempo and rhythm as before just deeper and louder.... Could this just be a jacked up muffler? internals broken or shot and completely different than the other side? I cant find anything wrong with it even though it sounds horrible .
     
    lilillill Thanks this.
  10. BoxCarKidd

    BoxCarKidd Road Train Member

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    Normally fuel goes through a primary filter, supply pump, secondary filter, tee split to a fuel galley ( supply front to back in each head ), return galley the same in each head. After the return tees back together is a restrictive fitting. Fuel should be the same throughout the system unless an injector is putting air back in the supply side. It would smoke like crazy. If you get it to run there is no other special bleeding. My experience with a bad valve on those caused them to pop out the exhaust bad and smoke puffy smoke bad. What is the exhaust temps on the other side.
    You may have some weak rings , low compression, but I thought it sounded OK.
    Your rack adjustment may not be equal between the banks.
     
    lilillill, Dino soar and Green461 Thank this.
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