Oh what fun! Elogs

I believe the regs say it has to be a minimum of 15 minutes.

But, we all know you can't do a full pre-trip in 15 minutes because of the time it takes to do the air brake tests, checking tire pressures (with a guage - not a thumper), checking fluid levels, etc.

Heck, it took longer than 15 minutes at the DMV test. And that was with the examiner letting me skip over much of it. (I would do this axle like the previous, except for..., I would do this side of the trailer the same as the other..., no tire pressure or fluid level checks, etc)

If you had an accident because of, say, the brake linings catching fire because they were to thin - and you had a habit of only logging a 15 minute pre-trip...
I'd bet dollars to donuts that they would call you on it and nail you for not doing a thorough inspection.


The super-truckers that say they can do a valid pre-trip in 15 minutes are the same type of drivers that will finish that long downgrade with burning brakes, or that will go over a cliff because they 'know how to handle an 80,000lb rig at 70MPH on a 60MPH turn.

 

Post the reg that says how long it has to be.








Here's a hint... you won't find it.

In fact, post the reg that says a driver has to do a pre-trip inspection.

Here's another hint... you won't find it either.

This is the problem when people really don't know the regs.

 

I've never once had an officer tell me to do a pre-trip in 15 minutes as per my logs.

That 15 minutes I save logging for my pre-trip accounts for TWO WEEKS a year. Over ten years it has made me lot's of money. I'll keep logging it in 15 minute increments without a single worry.

 

I do that air brake test at the end of my day, every day. Of course I did it at the beginning when I picked up the truck but I do it at the end of the day now. If there is a problem I want to know about it before the next day starts. It makes sense to go through the procedure at the end of the day anyway, the last part, pop out test drains the tanks, then hop out and pull the string and drain them all the rest of the way. Quick walk around with lights on, flashers check tires and brakes etc basically have done your pretrip for the next day right there except for checking fluids.My truck is checked throughout the day like you said, constantly being pretripped. I just log 15 minutes as a formality. If DOT asks if I can do it in that time period I will say "yes I can do it to my satisfaction", 'satisfaction' being the key word in the little green book that gets them to back off. Little green book says flag pretrip, log posttrip. I do that but in reverse. Swift wants 15 minutes pre and post, 15 minutes pre and post for each sleeper break split as well.

 

FMCSA § 396.13 Driver inspection.

Before driving a motor vehicle, the driver shall:
(a) Be satisfied that the motor vehicle is in safe operating condition;...

Technically you are correct, in an explicit sense, that it does not mandate a pre trip inspection. However, read closely, it is implied by this rule that the driver is satisfied the vehicle is safe by operating it and is saying so in his/her opinion as a trained commercial driver.

Seems to me, though, were this driver to get into an accident that was deemed preventable and lawyers could show that an inspection by a typical driver would have found the problem in a pre trip, that a jury could very likely find the driver guilty of negligence or incompetence. And if the company he/she drove for felt the driver did a crappy pre trip they'd be happy to throw them under the proverbial bus.

Not trying to start a pissing match. Just curious how you interpret the rule. I am no rule guru: I had to go to the FMCSA web site.

As I mentioned in another post, a decent pre trip has found significant issues for me that were easily remedied once found. I can do a good one in about 20 odd minutes. Heck, even the one necessary (to get my CDL) with state examiner took me less than 22 minutes including having to verbalize everything and do the air brake check. And anything less than 22.5 minutes is logged as 15 minutes anyway, right?

Better to do the pre trip than sit there, staring blankly out the window, while nursing a cup of coffee and pick my ash just to burn up the 15 minutes required by the company. That is just my opinion. There are likely some who have much more experience than me who will argue that they can tell if the vehicle is safe by the sound it makes or something.

I am just not that good or experienced and so have no choice but to do a proper pre trip in order to feel safe. If it costs me 15 minutes of driving time ($5 +/- a day before taxes?), and most days it will not, then so be it. I can live with that.

 

You get the cookie... but only one.

There's no implied about it, a driver has to (be able to articulate) be satisfied that the CMV is safe to operate. That most likely involves at least a walk around, or it may involve a full-blown pre-trip. That may be at the driver's discretion, or it may be a policy set by the carrier, but other circumstances have a bearing as well; does the driver have the same truck every day or is this the first day with this truck and/or trailer, etc.

As for how I do it, I usually flag a pre-trip and log a post-trip (as mandated by the FMCSA). I don't burn up any more time than is necessary, but I also own my truck and generally drag the same trailer all the time. I also do a walk around EVERY TIME I stop. Up here (Canada) I log a pre-trip and flag a post-trip. The type of inspection (pre- or post-) is not mandated so long as there is one every 24 hours. However, accepted practise is to perform a pre-trip.

 

Now with all of that... here's the real thing: How will that hold up in court? Lets say you're one of the types who doesn't think that a full brake check is necessary, and you come barrelling down a grade - WHOOPS!!! No brakes!!

If you haven't done that brake check (even though it's not specifically articulated in the FMCSRs,) if you haven't consistantly logged some time BEFORE heading out on the road at the beginning of your shift - you are opening yourself up to a negligence lawsuit by whomever you injure in your actions. Not only that... if the law decides that you're going to court on a criminal charge... you'll get the "negligent" form of whatever they charge you with - which generally carries around twice the prison term.

As a professional driver, you need to go beyond what you were used to happily careening down the road in your little 4-wheeler. You need to do EVERYTHING necessary AND possible - just to keep your happy arse out of a prison cell. Because ####e happens.

 

Well, lemme see... I got my Class 1 in 1984, no at fault accidents (I think I've been run into a couple of times), no tickets, no brake failures (never smoked 'em either), no violations, etc.

I think I'll let my record speak for itself.

P.S. Who said anything about not logging time at the beginning of a shift? I do, so you must be thinking of someone else. Same goes for brake checks, which I never mentioned, which are state specific, some being mandatory, some not, and which FMCSA would never address anyhow.

 

I never had this specifically, though I was challenged once on 15 minute unload times when I did route work. I have never known of this specific incident to happen, but its plausible, I suppose.